Get Insurance Or Pay The Us Gov't 1000$ +

[TheScotsman]

http://www.examiner.com/x-1087-Denver-News...economys-coffin

There is the end of the economy.

Bet you are going to LOVE paying the gov't a 1000$ fine for not buying health insurance.
The nanny-democrats know what you must have, and you are getting because they order you to.


Change you can't believe...

So what happens when the insurers just drop health coverage when they are forced into high risk coverages. Look at FL and CO with homeowners carriers just quitting the business.

Even more, what 20-something needs another 250$/month bill. payup time! elections have consequences, and this time the consequence is your money leaving your bank account.

[SimplexCoda]

Oh good, im so glad i can afford either one of those options. Oh hell i might as well do both, get insurance and pay the government a thousand bucks. Just cause i can.
Im sure glad that they are lookin out for my health. And the economy. At the same time. This is so good of them.

Im just about done with this crap hole some people call a country.

[Dr. B]

whatever.

[Vampy6997]

So....very....lame....

I don't even need health insurance. blah!

[Zyram]

Even though republicans spend just as much, at least they don't do it in the name of protecting me from myself. Usually. I hated the No Child Left Behind from Republicans but this will take the cake. The soft socialism we've had for the last few decades has finally advanced to the full fledged deal. We just can't decide between Socialism and Fascism, there are hints of both nowadays, maybe it'll be something completely new, a FacSocialism. Either way, I'm sure it'll be history repeating itself: Such systems do not work and eventually fall apart. Myself, I'm hoping one day the Republic of Texas will once again exist. Once the top heavy federal system collapses, maybe states will begin getting back the powers they have slowly ceded the past 150 years.

-Z

[Moefasaaa]

I could use some health insurance, haha. Tired of getting sick and just waiting it out...

[Scalliwag]

That's a link to an Op-Ed. In 1993 there was what was called "the deficit reduction act of 1993". Not a single republican voted for it. Gingrich, Lott, and the rest of the rightwingers said it would put us into another great depression. Well guess what? It didn't and as a matter of fact we did lower the deficit until dorkass GW and the rightwing came in and screwed shit up.
Don't buy into all this stupid shit. We basically borrowed a trillion dollars from China to fight a war in a third world country and repubs weren't bitching about that. Infuckingcredible they even open their retarded ass mouths talking about "wasting money" now.

Just because Ed Duffy or Rush Limpdick say something does not make it either a) true or the whole truth

[TheScotsman]

So....very....lame....

I don't even need health insurance. blah!

Exactly the point.

When someone is in their 20'30's that is the last bill most of them need. Illness at <35 is so rare it's just a waste of money.

It makes them the perfect target for a requirement to pay. The insurance companies (yes, big business) gets to pilfer your pockets, with very little chance of ever paying anything out. What happened to the dumbocraps that were so anti-big business? since they took power, they have rapidly done way more to benefit big business, at the cost of the average person than the repubs did in 8 years.

What's more, that 1000$ doesn't even buy you any insurance, it's a fine for not having any! You still don't have coverage, you are just another $1000. in the hole.

Of bary sotero's quoted 46 million uninsured we find about 10 million are illegal-immigrants!
17 million are individuals making 50,000$/yr (they can afford insurance if they chose to buy it)
7 million or so are making 75,000.00/yr. (normally young professionals who know it's just a waste for them).
Leaves us with 34 million people that are not insured as a result of their own choices. Hardly a national crisis.

There is no way I would want to be fresh out of college these days, if the job market isn't bad enough, the government is going to filch what $ you do have. Well, I guess it's something to get used to, with more hitting medicare every day, and fewer young workers entering with fewer jobs, someone has to pay all those entitlements. Looks like a long, dark road of brokeness.


No we borrowed trillions of dollars from china for obummer's stimulus bill that has done nothing. Well, I guess it did, it drove the unemployment past his promised point of, what was it? 9%? Scali just concetrate hard... try to get over the bush derangement syndrome. It's been long enough for the present admins policys to make it worse when he could have done differnet. Unless you actually do believe you can spend your way out of debt... must have failed functional math. bary sotero owns this mess, even the liberal media is figuring that out.

[Scalliwag]

No we borrowed trillions of dollars from china for obummer's stimulus bill that has done nothing. Well, I guess it did, it drove the unemployment past his promised point of, what was it? 9%? Scali just concetrate hard... try to get over the bush derangement syndrome. It's been long enough for the present admins policys to make it worse when he could have done differnet. Unless you actually do believe you can spend your way out of debt... must have failed functional math. bary sotero owns this mess, even the liberal media is figuring that out.

Uhhh, nope, you been listening to too much Limpdick. Bush Derangement Syndrome may sound catchy but you "act" (and yes I do mean act) as though Obama is responsible for every negative thing since he took office.
Since you seem to know so much Scotty, exactly where did the money come from that we spent on the war? Just like Bush and the repubs kept those numbers off the books all these years you want to overlook the complete and dismal failure your beloved party bestowed upon us.
A wise-ass remark does not change anything. Blame the liberal media and pretend that republicans are victims of bad press instead of taking personal responsibility for 8 years of failure.

Before you go crying and whining about Obama you should take a bit of responsibility for your party and the hole they dug.

[SimplexCoda]

No we borrowed trillions of dollars from china for obummer's stimulus bill that has done nothing. Well, I guess it did, it drove the unemployment past his promised point of, what was it? 9%? Scali just concetrate hard... try to get over the bush derangement syndrome. It's been long enough for the present admins policys to make it worse when he could have done differnet. Unless you actually do believe you can spend your way out of debt... must have failed functional math. bary sotero owns this mess, even the liberal media is figuring that out.

Uhhh, nope, you been listening to too much Limpdick. Bush Derangement Syndrome may sound catchy but you "act" (and yes I do mean act) as though Obama is responsible for every negative thing since he took office.
Since you seem to know so much Scotty, exactly where did the money come from that we spent on the war? Just like Bush and the repubs kept those numbers off the books all these years you want to overlook the complete and dismal failure your beloved party bestowed upon us.
A wise-ass remark does not change anything. Blame the liberal media and pretend that republicans are victims of bad press instead of taking personal responsibility for 8 years of failure.

Before you go crying and whining about Obama you should take a bit of responsibility for your party and the hole they dug.

I have to say, i think both parties are just a bunch of liars.

Of course they do what their big business partners want. They pay their bills, not voters. Why the hell should any politician care about what the voters say?

[Scalliwag]

I have to say, i think both parties are just a bunch of liars.
Of course they do what their big business partners want. They pay their bills, not voters. Why the hell should any politician care about what the voters say?

I agree with that statement because it's the nature of politics. When the Nazi's took power in Germany what were the opposition parties at the time? Most people have no idea but most people would agree that any of them almost had to be the lesser of the evil SOB's the Nazi's were.
I'm a moderate. Moderates have no say in todays republican party. So the best I can shoot for is the lesser of the two evils.
EVERY time one republican makes a disparaging remark about Rush Limbaugh, the next day they are profusely apologizing about it. That party has devolved into a pathetic mess. We need a viable third party but until then this is what we got.

[Bulldog_916]

Obama and the administration didnt even know how far job cuts would go. Big corps are trying to keep their balance sheets looking alright and cutting any cost they can, including good workers, to do that. 9 percent sounded like about as deep as it would go at the time, most analysts agreed. Now that it's hovering near 10%, they're considering other measures. Frankly, I think we need to leave everything alone. Keep the economy this way a while and cut back where we can to bring spending in line. I think it's more that America has gotten too bloated for her own good. There arent enough companies to hire all the workers who have been laid off and now the companies are finding that they dont need those people back, since productivity is up something like 6 percent since the recession began. I give it till the middle of 2010 and the economy will have roared back and oil will be back up to near 140 a barrel due to inflationary concerns. That's when interest rates need to go back up to keep the value of the dollar steady. Knowing how things have gone recently, I dont see that happening.

[Vampy6997]

So....very....lame....

I don't even need health insurance. blah!

Exactly the point.

When someone is in their 20'30's that is the last bill most of them need. Illness at <35 is so rare it's just a waste of money.

I'm not saying young people don't need insurance...if the person was a young person like myself, they would need that health insurance just in case. I could use health insurance to cover hospital bills for hospitals outside the VA hospital, but that happens once every 2-3 yrs or so for myself. If I had my daughter, I would've needed health insurance to get her covered until she reached about 3-4 yrs old. Right now? I go to the VA and they don't charge me. Unless I get sick of the VA hospital, as shitty as it is, I won't need health insurance, ever....unless I got really rich magically, cuz then I would definitely need it. (lol)...

If a young person rarely gets sick (unlike present company), they shouldn't need to get healthcare just cuz the gov't thinks they need it. Ok...money goes into the health insurance company, gov't makes taxes off said insurance plan, gov't makes taxes off unnecessary checkups with a primary care doc (everyone would be required to go to these)...what about this...gov't tracks addresses via health insurance companies and car insurance companies...well...car insurance...not everyone drives a car, but everyone has a need for health care at some point or another, so thus making us more trackable?...similar stuff has happened with websites visited via google. The gov't asked google for all said info...not sure what they'd do with likely billions of pages, but whatever.

The census is coming around this up coming year...(slight food for thought)

Tracking mileage by charging per mile taxes rather than taxes on gas (makes people who drive trackable).

How would the government know whether a person has or doesn't have insurance (without already having a file on everyone)?....Would they have some official at every doc's office?...hospital?...etc?

What about illegals...they don't need to get health insurance, and then get to pay out of pocket unlike everyone else?....

Sorry for such streamline thinking...This isn't all obama's fault, because I'm pretty sure every president is just a puppet...It's probably, either way, the lesser of two evils...making bad shit happen regardless of who's in office, just relate the bad shit to whatever party the pres is affiliated with...this keeps people from ever going independent on a wide enough scale, or voting for an alternative president. The penduluum would keep getting pushed back and forth from one side to another.

Dum de dum dum....I'm done. lol....feel free to disagree, but I'm not arguing about anything...just more/less asking questions.

[ashes87]

This makes me pretty upset because my insurance company dropped me last year, before I was fully covered by them because I was in the hospital right before the coverage kicked in, so they said that I had a "pre-existing condition".

I have an immune disorder, and have to take meds everyday just to keep from being in the hospital again, and because of whats wrong with me, I fall into the high risk category.

I dont see the point in fighting to get health insurance right now, but if the government is going to try and charge me $1000 for not having health insurance, then I will ask if they want to pay my $20,000 hospital bill due to getting dropped by insurance.

Whatever though, I am to the point I dont care anymore, everything just sucks in general.

[Scalliwag]

This makes me pretty upset because my insurance company dropped me last year, before I was fully covered by them because I was in the hospital right before the coverage kicked in, so they said that I had a "pre-existing condition".

I have an immune disorder, and have to take meds everyday just to keep from being in the hospital again, and because of whats wrong with me, I fall into the high risk category.

I dont see the point in fighting to get health insurance right now, but if the government is going to try and charge me $1000 for not having health insurance, then I will ask if they want to pay my $20,000 hospital bill due to getting dropped by insurance.

Whatever though, I am to the point I dont care anymore, everything just sucks in general.

Some insurance companies have practices that should land them in jail. This is a pretty interesting story that I hope leads to some major changes.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/07/02/insurance...iref=newssearch

[Sonthert]

Its stupid. I could have predicted this when they made auto insurance mandatory in many places. If they make it a requirement, then you will watch the insurance rates go up...since you can't get away without it. They could charge whatever they want to.

Facism? Yeah, seriously. Soft socialism? I think not. We have two choices. We can adhere to some political paradigm and become marxists or free-market capitalists or whatever. All of these paradigms are simply excuses why the citizens should accept 2nd class treatment. Why should we put up with bullshit? For the greater good. The other alternative, which we have employed in the past, but are doing less-so now is to take pieces from any paradigm we want to. Who wants to get rid of socialized fire fighting services? Hmm? Nobody. We pay for it, with our taxes. We can pick and choose elements from any political system we want to. Its only when we start eschewing one political paradigm that the people have to suffer. Otherwise, we can maximize our utility from the government by taking elements that we think will make our lives the best.

That being said, Facism (AKA the Police State) stops all that. It needs to be stopped before anything else.

The media used to be something respectable. Now the media is complicit in all the dishonesty that weighs this country down. If Facism marched in, the media would be selling advertising time. We need to reinstate the rules that governed the media 20 years ago. I don't care about their ratings. They are there to serve the American people, not rack up ratings. The media has failed. It now openly conveys false and deceptive information without repercussion. If its a choice between the media's "Freedom of Speech" and American Freedom and having accurate information to exercise democracy (Thomas Jefferson). I say every media executive can go to jail for 100 years.

I spent an hour and 20 minutes combing the text of long and boring bills before the House and the Senate. I looked through the Senate's Bill's first, which is of course, assuming it passes the House...S-423, S-441, S-486, S-698, S-1240 and the corresponding bills in the House HR1016, HR1296, HR1468, HR1495. These fines haven't hit the bills yet. The AP story associated with the op-ed piece connects it to discussions in the Senate. Ironically, they make the comparison to auto insurance (after I had already wrote it)

Its entirely possible that this is article is a distortion. I am inclined to believe that it is. We'll have to wait until the digest of the Senate is published next Thursday to find out. Lets ask a practical question here, before we continue...is the US system going to be like Canada where a person can walk into a hospital and get free medical care if they don't have insurance? If so, who cares about a $1000 fine?

If the AP article is true, its an obvious blow job for the medical insurance companies and it is awful. Stop jerking off and dispense with insurance companies, HMOs and Contribution plans. If the AP article is a distortion...and I suspect that this is a distortion; a product of this failed media system of ours. In this latter case, The Denver News Examiner should be ashamed for allowing such a dilatory and obviously idiotic piece to be printed. It shows a lack of integrity on their part, a lack of respect for the tradition of newsprint and they should be ashamed for printing a muckraking, bellicose piece of yellow journalism.

The fines are no means set in stone. There are four bills rotating around in each house of Congress. Some are more comprehensive than others, the fines may be associated with only one of the bills. Before going off half-cocked, lets find out whats really happening. There are numerous mentions of subsidies for the poor and Middle Class. How much is the differential? The hidden story is that the Senate is talking about medical premiums of $2000 per year. With subsidies, how much could the bill be? If the subsidies are about $1000...About $1000/yr for medical coverage? So pay $1000 for medical care or $1000 for no medical coverage? The system might be loaded to penalize the rich for not participating and ignore the poor and largely ignore the middle class for not getting medical care. What if the subsidies are $1500/yr? Then its $500/yr for medical coverage or $1000/yr for no medical coverage. If you see what I'm saying. Maybe the poor would get nearly subsidized entirely. Taking this piece out of context with the rest of the bill that encircles it is highly reactionary.

Leave it to the media to try and bullshit us and get us all pissed off for nothing. I think the first thing we should do to get this country back on track is to do away with big Media and almost eliminate the costs of advertising on radio and TV which would allow companies spending millions on advertising (and trashing small companies with smaller budgets) to spend their money on employing workers rather than bullshit advertising that we TiVo over anyhow. Huge advertising costs on rado and TV just make the climate more difficult for small companies and subsidize media corporations to try and run our lives and feed us low quality bullshit like The Denver News Examiner and Fox News do. It would also protect the internet from the big money takeover thats taking hold. It would make advertising time for alternate candidates in politics far cheaper so more of an even playing field could be achieved. The airwaves belong to us. They are the property of the Citizens of The United States of America...we should be making the airwaves work for us and our best interests, not allowing the media parasites to suck the liberty and freedom out of our veins.

[Scalliwag]

that's why I was critical of the Op-Ed article this whole thread was based on. The guy that wrote it is not going to be held accountable for his bullshit no more than that fat dopehead Rush Limpdick is held accountable for his.
Their mindless ditto errrrr dildoheads repeat their BS.
Here is a great documentary about Lee Atwater. He was Karl Rove's mentor and an evil POS. The so-called "liberal media" helped this guy propogate his lies. Fortunately the sorry bastard died of a brain tumor but not before he spawned Rove
I hear these nut jobs refer to liberal media and it really solidifies their ignorance http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eY3XnLv4YpA Atwater would have never succeeded had they done their jobs and all the coverups led to the Iraq war neither.

[ashes87]

Thanks for the link Scalli, and that story is about par for me, except the company that denied me was Blue Cross, Blue Shield.
Your right, some of the practices these companies have should land them in jail, but nothing gets done.

Sonthert said it best though:

The airwaves belong to us. They are the property of the Citizens of The United States of America...we should be making the airwaves work for us and our best interests, not allowing the media parasites to suck the liberty and freedom out of our veins.

[Scalliwag]

I'm 48... I know I'm old.... well I don't feel it and most the forum people that have been over will confess I'm a really active guy. I've been very fortunate that the only thing up until recently kick my ass was a kidney stone. I thought something ruptured and as bad as it hurt honestly thought I was probably dying. No broken bones, no stitches.
Relatively dangerous jobs until I was 36 and got into IT.
I was a welder most of those years prior and in some shops that over the years people had even been killed in. Namely three guys got crushed by the side panel of a boxcar. (this is leading to something )

I used to have helpers over the years that were dumbasses right out of school and my main concern was always making sure they did not get hurt/killed while trying to help me out. I would cut a thick piece of plate steel with a cutting torch and the next thing you know a helped would try and pick up the scrap bare handed or something that would be devastating.
I had a thing I would play on them that after a real close call I would ask them how old they were and then get them to hold up there hands so I could count their fingers and I would act amazed that they still had them all. I would follow that up that if they did not stay on their toes in these types of environments that losing a finger would be the least of their worries. I always hoped they near misses would be something that would stick with them.

Low and behold after all these years I lose half a finger and had another reconstructed over a freak-ass situation I replay over and over and over in my head.
Several people that got hurt got hurt over other peoples dumbass mistakes.
After Iwas laid off last year and took a job as a contractor and my wife is self-employed my wife shopped and got us the best insurance we could get out-of-pocket or out-the-ass/ up-the-ass is more like it. 7 months later this happens.
The insurance does not even cover therapy so I can get use of my rebuilt finger and I'm not 100% sure what all they are going to cover on the surgery.
So I'm paying out of pocket for the therapy on my hand because I actually use my middle finger for more than sign language when driving.

When I was younger I never needed insurance except dental but I sure saw a lot of people that did. My luck ran out. You don't want to play percentages games on something like this because you can't afford to lose.
And I don't give a shit how tough you think you are.... there are a lot of bad asses every day needing insurance that thought they didn't. There are insurance companies just as crooked as Enron and run by dickheads like Bernie Madoff's.
I personally want these people to start being eligible for the death penalty myself. These pricks have cost the lives of others and are murderers as far as I'm concerned. I would have no problem beating a Jeff Skilling, Ken Lay, or Bernie Madoff within an inch of their lives for some of the things these people have done to others.
I hate people that manipulate and prey on others and view them as terrorists.

p.s.- my hand being in a flipping stint makes me grumpy..... sorry folks Especially hate your situation Ash. I still have one good arm to beat this living piss outta somebody if you can find me a culprit

[ashes87]

Scalli, I will stay on the lookout for someone you can beat

I understand exactly what you are saying though. Until April, I was working as independent contractor for a wireless broadband internet company, and the only reason I stopped was because I fell off of a roof. I got lucky, all I did was sprain my foot, but the doc told me I would have been better off breaking it.

If it wasn't for that, along with having Crohn's Disease, I would probably still be working that job, but I am better off not working it since I dont have health insurance, and that I have last years hospital bill staring me in the face along with my e.r visit from April.

It is just sad and pathetic that the insurance company is not covering your therapy, so you have to pay it out of pokcet. Therapy is not cheap, I know because I have had friends who have had to go through it for various reasons. I will be the first to admit that I am nowhere as tough as I like to think that I am, but I do know that one day, I am going to run out of luck, and I hope I have insurance by then.

[Scalliwag]

the only good thing is the therapy center arranged for us to make payments as well as lowered the normal costs. They tried to get the insurance company to take care of it and realized I was screwed.
I had already met the therapists and we hit it off really good and I know they pushed to get their accounting people to make this work. It's costing me $125 per session that supposed to be an hour but we always go over and get into the next hour and they bring in another patient and kinda multitask and let me get more out of it.
On top of that they have it to where I'm paying $25 per week until it's paid off.
In the end this is going to still be pricey, I have 2 sessions one week and one the next over and over for months to come.

So I have a whole lot to be thankful for. The therapy center has a lot of patients so it's not like they're needing me nearly as much as I needed them. These people are angels (and my therapist is a doll to look at )

But at the same time this only came about because the insurance company are serpents so I'm calling a spade a spade on this shit. While the Obama plan may or may not be as good as I'd like to hope for, the insurance companies are like the the rest of the ponzi scheme assholes and it has been ignored too long.
If McCain was prez and the repubs controlled shit this would not even be addressed just like they never addressed abuses like Enron until the lid came off and they could not pretend the 800 pound gorilla was not sitting in the middle of the damn room.
1993 was the last time the issue was addressed. Repubs would say we had problems but never did jackshit about it.
Now they wanna bitch about it. Them bitches shoulda fixed the mess and we would not even be having this conversation. fuggin assholes

[TheScotsman]

I have to say, i think both parties are just a bunch of liars.
Of course they do what their big business partners want. They pay their bills, not voters. Why the hell should any politician care about what the voters say?

I agree with that statement because it's the nature of politics. When the Nazi's took power in Germany what were the opposition parties at the time? Most people have no idea but most people would agree that any of them almost had to be the lesser of the evil SOB's the Nazi's were.
I'm a moderate. Moderates have no say in todays republican party. So the best I can shoot for is the lesser of the two evils.
EVERY time one republican makes a disparaging remark about Rush Limbaugh, the next day they are profusely apologizing about it. That party has devolved into a pathetic mess. We need a viable third party but until then this is what we got.

Obambi's BS ROE in assganistan is going to make Iraq look like a joyride. Wait 3 more years, and let's compare costs.

Who cares about the republsaurus, they are a slightly less loonie-leftie version of the dumbocraps. Sotero can only claim victory as a result of the fact mccain was just as bad, and most any true conservative wouldn't vote for either.

The economic mess is a democrap invention. As it's still fun to pick on obummer, it's equaly true that CONGRESS not the president sets the budget, programs, and economic results. Anyone with half a brain knows the single biggest cause of the FM/FMK collapse, and housing price bubble was democrapper Barney "I tawt I taw a putie tat" Frank, and his buddies. And now they are trying to reinflate the bubble! Even more, he's blocked attempts to regulate fannie mae/freddie to prevent yet another reoccurance! Now you can prance about yelling "bush did it" all you want, but the truth is if you had to find ONE single most responsible culprit, it's Barny-"I tawt I taw a puite tat"-Frank.

[Scalliwag]

guess what? If GW would have taken out Afghanistan instead of concentrating on Iraq we'd be done by now there.
And no I know how budgets work. As a matter of fact I remember Clinton raking Newt Gingrinch and his cronies over the coals when they tried to shut down the government over it.
I don't remember any standoffs GW stood his ground? All but two were presented by repubs so not much going for that argument for ya.

And Freddie and Fannie is all the fault of one congressman. What a concept. Then again the entire post looks like a drunken rambling. Democrats invented the economic mess.
And republicans are against bigger government I guess? No wait, how big is the Dept. of Homeland Security?

Just because Rush spews that crap does not make it true bro Remember he's a dope addict

[Hookah_Bob3]

The rest of the posts were too numerous, but I have to point something out to you, Scalli. but read this: http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/30/business...ge-lending.html

It wasn't GW that started the majority of the mess. It was Clinton. You can thank him for the housing market crash (and subsequently the rest of the economy).

On another note, keep up the good innovations

[Scalliwag]

The rest of the posts were too numerous, but I have to point something out to you, Scalli. but read this: http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/30/business...ge-lending.html

It wasn't GW that started the majority of the mess. It was Clinton. You can thank him for the housing market crash (and subsequently the rest of the economy).

On another note, keep up the good innovations

I'm certainly not saying Fannie and Freddie were not a mess but that is by far not the beginning and end of all of of this nor the bigger of the problems. AIG was the big dawg ad created by far the most havoc in our economic situation.
AIG is the big daddy there http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2008/09/aig_i...ds_or_less.html Furthemore as with deregulating the S&L's and what led to the biggest fed bailout by taxpayers at that time the things that led up to that were deregulation championed by republicans. Anybody that has kept up with politics at all knows that while some dems have been complacent, they were not the movers and shakers on that cause.
Furthermore just to prove what great recent ideas some of you may remember because this was not too many years back, GW was giving all those speeches about what a great soluion privatizing social securitiy would be by "allowing" people to invest it in the stock market and most the repubs were onboard with that.... that was until the stock market got so shakey and what happened? Just like with the S&L bullshit the proponents suddenly got real quiet on that. It's a damn good thing we did not invest into that scam.
While I don't trust the goverment I certainly do not tust the Bernie Madoff's, Ken Lay's, Jeff Skilling's of this world.
Until they start executing these SOB's for their crimes I strongly suggest they (the individuals) just get put out of business. Those types need to be scared to the point they've never seen. They need at minimum to go to general population prisons that house violent criminals. After all in the white-collar world they believe in survival of the first right? Let's see how well they do once the playing field is levelled there.
I know that sounds like a shocking oncept to some but I happen to think a great deterent would be for Jeff Skilling or Madoff to be beat to death in a prison ruckus which happens all the time but doesn't make the news unless it's high profile like Jeffrey Dahmer. Most of the swindler's take being pussies to a whole new level so I think we would be rather entertaining to hear how their day to day life in a place that has them scared shitless would be.
Here is a good article on the push for deregulation http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/polit...es/cf031295.htm